[GPSNavX]

Development is progressing well. The expectation is to have support in less than 60 days. I hate promising dates, but will do my absolute best to meet that deadline.

I do believe S-57 Vector charts are the future for marine navigation so that will be the focus for the forseeable future.

[Eclipsemullet]

I do believe S-57 Vector charts are the future for marine navigation so that will be the focus for the forseeable future.

I would appreciate a little briefing on this S-57 stuff. I am new to digital charting.

Many thanks.

--Andy

[FF44]

For a complete overview about ENCs charts (S-57 format), you may download one of these two PDFs :
[url=http://francis.fustier.free.fr/Forums/ENC_English.pdf]English version
[url=http://francis.fustier.free.fr/Forums/ENC_French.pdf]French version


Best
Francis

[Eclipsemullet]

Many thanks. I will take a look.

At the moment we have Maptech charts and this will be our first season with GPSnavX.

--Andy

[phowson]

I just downloaded the entire set of ENC charts from NOAA and am looking forward to getting my hands on GPSNavX with S-57 capabilities. It has always bothered me that I have to pay Maptech for information that my taxes already pay for.

[cyberhusky]

It has always bothered me that I have to pay Maptech for information that my taxes already pay for

Well you're lucky over there in the USA. Here in Europe we have to pay for S57 maps. :-(

[phowson]

Well you're lucky over there in the USA. Here in Europe we have to pay for S57 maps. :-(

That's why I downloaded them now, before Maptech sends their lobbyist after the congress and suddenly they ENC charts are only available through Maptech for some moronic reason.

The entire set of ENC charts takes up 712 MB after downloading, pretty impressive considering that I have 3 chartkit CDs from Maptech (raster charts with GPS data) that take up about the same amount of space on my hard drive and only cover the east coast of Florida to Norfolk, VA and the northern reaches of the Chesapeake Bay.

Just out of curiosity, who is selling the S-57 charts and what are they charging?

[ReeferJon]

Usually, the hydrographic office / government of the country concerned.

In the UK it's the UKHO. They chart about £15 a chart!

Out of interested, can you run NOAA S57 charts on any hardware GPS plotters out there?

[cyberhusky]

Just out of curiosity, who is selling the S-57 charts and what are they charging?

Check this page http://www.ukho.gov.uk/admiralty_enc_service.html for infos about S57 chart and prices.

[ginginsman]

For a complete overview about ENCs charts (S-57 format), you may download one of these two PDFs :
[url=http://francis.fustier.free.fr/Forums/ENC_English.pdf]English version
[url=http://francis.fustier.free.fr/Forums/ENC_French.pdf]French version

Excellent article. I've used a couple of Windoze ENC viewers to look at S-57 charts, and indeed, as pointed out here before, the appearance is not nearly as useful in the traditional manner of the raster/BSB charts.

Hypack has a good article here about S-57 basics
http://www.hypack.com/newsletter/5_03/pat_1.htm
and they appear to offer an editor as well (Windoze-based):
http://www.hypack.com/hypack.asp

Does anyone know how one "enhances" S-57's? When adding a waypoint, is it added to the digital data in the S-57 chart? Are there other editors for making one's own enhancements? Is there a good URL for learning this kind of thing about S-57's?

[JackConnick]

I just downloaded the entire set of ENC charts from NOAA and am looking forward to getting my hands on GPSNavX with S-57 capabilities. It has always bothered me that I have to pay Maptech for information that my taxes already pay for.

Can you provide a link?

TIA,
Jack

[ginginsman]

I just downloaded the entire set of ENC charts from NOAA and am looking forward to getting my hands on GPSNavX with S-57 capabilities. It has always bothered me that I have to pay Maptech for information that my taxes already pay for.

Can you provide a link?

TIA,
Jack

http://chartmaker.ncd.noaa.gov/mcd/enc/download.htm

[phowson]

Just got an email announcing the imminent arrival of MacENC. Apparently it's going to cost $99.00 for a CD with the application and the ENC charts from NOAA. I am curious as to whether or not there will be an upgrade path for those of us who already paid for GPSNavX.

Also, while it's nice of them to go out and download the ENC charts from NOAA, I would personally rather see a lower price for a download-of-software-only version and then I would download the charts myself.

Once again, I already paid for the ENC charts when I paid my taxes so ...

[ginginsman]

Just got an email announcing the imminent arrival of MacENC. Apparently it's going to cost $99.00 for a CD with the application and the ENC charts from NOAA. I am curious as to whether or not there will be an upgrade path for those of us who already paid for GPSNavX.

Also, while it's nice of them to go out and download the ENC charts from NOAA, I would personally rather see a lower price for a download-of-software-only version and then I would download the charts myself.

Once again, I already paid for the ENC charts when I paid my taxes so ...

Given how many comments there have been on the forum about the incredible value of GPSNavX at $50, it seems hardly exaggerated to ask $99 for the ENC version. Look at the ENC charts on the CD as a freebee for the buyer's convenience, to accompany the program price of $99. Upgrade paths is another matter, though again, depending on the feature set of MacENC, it may be entirely reasonable a price.

I was surprised to see it as a separate program, but I don't know enough as yet about the technical ins and outs of why that is being done that way.

[pkluyt]

Usually, the hydrographic office / government of the country concerned. In the UK it's the UKHO. They chart about £15 a chart!

In Europe official maritime ENCs are either distributed by Primar or IC ENC via their official chart distributers. Unfortunately both have a tight encryption scheme to discourage copying (and tampering) with the data. To work with these ENCs the chart display software needs to be compatible with their licensing set-up that requires user codes, etc. I do hope that the wonderful GPSNavX team are willing to go through this effort.

The discusssion if taxpayers have to pay again for ENCs is presently going on with regard to ENC for inland waterways. As a first European country Austria has decided to distribute their Inland ENCs for free, see <http://www.doris.bmvit.gv.at/index.php?id=2513&L=0>. At this site you can also find links to free Inland ENCs from some other Danube countries. It looks like also Belgium is going to distribute the Inland ENCs for free and I keep my hope up for the Netherlands, but this has not been decided yet. Test data is however available at <http://www.risserver.nl/ENC/>

On the other hand Inland ENCs use an extended set of symbols. To see all the traffic signs and specific inland bouys and beacons, these need to be added to MacENC. Being involved in the standardisation of Inland ECDIS and a harmonisation effort with the US Corps of Army Engineers I would be happy to assist the GPSNavX/ MacENC team to do these extensions.

Best regards, Peter

Peter Kluytenaar
Serendipity UnLtd, 
Veerkade 15, 3016 DE Rotterdam, the Netherlands 
T. +31 10 4361954

[phowson]

My opinion:

I wouln't mind paying an additional $50 for an upgrade to MacENC but I have always maintained that software developers (and I used to work for one in the marketing department), especially small shops, rely heavily on loyal customers spreading the word about their product through word of mouth. Part of that is recognizing and acknowledging that the development of the current version would not have been possible without the support of the people who bought the prior versions and an upgrade path is a way of thanking and retaining loyal customers. While I agree that at $99 MacENC is a bargain, it is always a good idea to reward the people who have been with you in the past. Don't forget that they also contribute to the development by providing not only the financial and marketing support, but also the product feedback that shaped the product.

[stevjo]

My feelings exactly. I feel that asking me, a user for over a year who just subscribed to updates, to pay the same amount to use this new feature, as a user who just found the product, does not make me a loyal user. How about an upgrade price.

[ginginsman]

Does anyone know of a newsgroup on S-57 / ENC's?

[howiegilbert]

It's great to see a Mac program (MacENC) with S-57 ENC support.

However, I must agree with others here, there should be an upgrade price for loyal customers that have paid to subscribe to updates and have been spreading the word about your great product. I know I convinced a friend of mine to buy a Mac just so he could buy and run GPSNavX. He did so after seeing the program running on my boat.

That said, I absolutely love GPSNavX, I think it's a great program that just keeps getting better and you have always been there with great customer service whenever I had any questions.

Thx

[howiegilbert]

It's great to see a Mac program (MacENC) with S-57 ENC support.

However, I must agree with others here, there should be an upgrade price for loyal customers that have paid to subscribe to updates and have been spreading the word about your great product. I know I convinced a friend of mine to buy a Mac just so he could buy and run GPSNavX. He did so after seeing the program running on my boat.

That said, I absolutely love GPSNavX, I think it's a great program that just keeps getting better and you have always been there with great customer service whenever I had any questions.

Thx

[JackConnick]

It's great to see a Mac program (MacENC) with S-57 ENC support.

However, I must agree with others here, there should be an upgrade price for loyal customers that have paid to subscribe to updates and have been spreading the word about your great product. I know I convinced a friend of mine to buy a Mac just so he could buy and run GPSNavX. He did so after seeing the program running on my boat.

That said, I absolutely love GPSNavX, I think it's a great program that just keeps getting better and you have always been there with great customer service whenever I had any questions.

Thx

Ditto here.
Jack

s/v Maggie May, I-28

[bobetter]

I am a long time user of GPSNavX, in fact I believe version 1 is still in my"Old GPSNavX" folder. I just today joined this Forum. Reading this topic(MacENC) has given me some amusement. I've been navigating electronically for about 20 years starting with version 1 of NavimaQ and various PC apps using Virtual PC, with varying degrees of success. Not one of the PC apps cost less than $250. NavimaQ was, if I remember correctly about $100 many years ago. I can't imagine why anyone would expect
MacENC to be marketed for less than currently offered. NavimaQ is gone mainly because the developer got bored and wasn't making any money. I would hate to see GPSNavX/MacENC disappear for the same reasons. At$100, MacENC is a steal, I for one, would have no problem with a price point double that. I just completed a Trans Atlantic delivery aboard a 37 foot sloop using GPSNavX exclusively with complete success. If MacENC is as good as GPSNavX, I think it will start to give the full-blown PC apps a run for their money.
(putting on my flame-retardant suit now)
Bob Etter

[ReeferJon]

Rather a hot topic, this one!

The GPSNavX team have obviously put in a great deal of work on MacENC, while still managing to deliver loads of point release upgrades to GPSNavX. When I bought GPSNavX, I never thought I was going to get GRIB weather file support OR AIS support for free.. but I have, and I'm grateful. I think everyone agrees that MacENC is a good deal, when compared to commercial PC apps, and has a richer feature set compared to most of the low end / free PC apps.

Having said that, I can understand where existing GPSNavX users are coming from. I s'pose it's all down to marketing & managing customer expectations. I personally, don't have an issue paying $99 for MacENC (once I find UK charts that work with it.. more on this later.) but it's good to feel valued as a customer. Being offered an upgrade discount on any product is seen as a recognition of customer loyalty... and actually has very little to do with saving money! The crazy thing is, if MacENC had an RRP of $129, and an upgrade price of $99, everyone here would probably be happy to pay! Consumer psychology... you gotta love it!!

But for me, the main issue is finding non-US charts. I understand that the majority of GPSNavX users are from the US and get free NOAA charts... therefore buying MacENC, for them, is real no-brainer.

However for us "foreigners" (who I would guess make up a significant minority of users) it's a different issue. I bought GPSNavX immediately after Maptech BSB chart support was announced, because I knew I could purchase European charts in that format, at a reasonable price. At the moment there's no point in me buying MacENC, until I can purchase compatible consumer-priced S57 cartography. From what I understand from previous posts on MacSailing.net and other boards, there are two main obstacles to be overcome: including compatible decryption within MacENC (European charts are encrypted) and getting reasonably priced charts.

In Europe official maritime ENCs are either distributed by Primar or IC ENC via their official chart distributers. Unfortunately both have a tight encryption scheme to discourage copying (and tampering) with the data. To work with these ENCs the chart display software needs to be compatible with their licensing set-up that requires user codes, etc. I do hope that the wonderful GPSNavX team are willing to go through this effort....

...Being involved in the standardisation of Inland ECDIS and a harmonisation effort with the US Corps of Army Engineers I would be happy to assist the GPSNavX/ MacENC team to do these extensions.

I would also be more than happy to assist where I can, as I'm sure would the majority of European users. I am a business analyst / software architect by profession, so with the correct technical documentation, would be happy to liase with the appropriate goverment offices, and to put together a project for analysis, integration and testing of European S57 charts; but maybe GPSNavX are already progressing with this....

Having said all of this, congratulations to GPSNavX for all of their hard work. I'm really looking forward to seeing some detailed screenshots and (if one's being released) having a play with a trial version..... even if I'm limited to "technical appreciation" rather than real use!

[pkluyt]

Does anyone know of a newsgroup on S-57 / ENC's?

Look at www.openecdis.org

Best regards, Peter